From: Jerry Blount [jerry@eldorable.kscoxmail.com] Sent: Monday, December 04, 2006 9:19 AM To: 'Ahmed El Sayed'; itallaboutsisqo@yahoogroups.com; thegarbagezone@yahoogroups.com; sum41-1@yahoogroups. com; topthedoc@yahoogroups.com; truth_of_religion@yahoogroups.com; Heavens_People_Of_Truth_and_Faith@yahoogroups.com; pley2lem@yahoo.com; goldwingdoc@yahoo.com; katherine_fernandez1@yahoo.com; lenirt@yahoo.com; marjcomia@yahoo.com; mrtubije2002@yahoo.com; siklism@yahoo.com; luisavelazquez3@yahoo.com; jan_zer01@yahoo.com; mhai722@yahoo.com; alan. wong@southernlion.com.my; yapsp5@yahoo.co.uk; cwwong@msg.com.my; wwfs@pd.jaring.my; sktan.pad@slion.po. my; bltan@gulf.com.my; lsshien@gmail.com; hcsiau@marco-groups.com; sweetdreamlisa@yahoo.com; ling. yw@southernlion.com.my; judy32980@yahoo.co.uk; catherine.wong@southernlion.com.my; limkk@chevrontexaco.com; agnes.chow@southernlion.com.my; bodhi70@hotmail.com; andrew7khoo@yahoo.com; lainethorn@yahoo.com; cristyhna@yahoo.com; ctganzon@yahoo.com; emz_acad@yahoo.com; rodelyn_presno@yahoo.com; ronchelle2004@yahoo.com; kitkat_azutea@yahoo.com; hdbanaga_921@yahoo.com; peterasseater@yahoo.com; schanncell@yahoo.com; arman.pangan@siemens.com; vsherry9@aol.com; asad_rind@yahoo.co.in Subject: RE: Mavis B Jolly Ahmed, and Mavis I have been receiving your emails. I am a Christian, and have been watching with interest the sugar coating many of your teachings. I want to consider this part of your email (I retained the entire email you sent me below) “No doubt, influenced by the usual condemnation of Islam from Christian pulpits on the subject, I picked on polygamy. At last I thought I had something; obviously Western monogamy was an improvement on this old system. I talked of it to my Muslim friend. He illustrated with the aid of newspaper articles how much true monogamy there was in England, and convinced me that a limited polygamy was the answer to the secret unions that are becoming so distressingly common in the West. My own common sense could see that, particularly after a war, when women of a certain age group far outnumber men, a percentage of them are destined to remain spinsters. Did God give them life for that? I recollect that on the radio programme known as `Dear Sir' an unmarried English girl had called for lawful polygamy, saying she would prefer a shared married life rather than the loneliness to which she seemed to be destined. In Islam no one is forced into a polygamous marriage, but in a perfect religion, the opportunity must be there to meet those cases where it is necessary. “ Why did you not bring up Aisha?   Muhammad married her at age 6, had sex with her (molested her) at age 9.  Muhammad was 55. He would have done hard time as a child molester in a Federal prison if he were living here.  This is actually the same thing that Jefferies fellow (also claims to be a prophet) is going into a trial for right now.   Muhammad claimed God was also speaking through him when he ordered Zahid (Muhammad’s adopted son) to divorce his wife and give her to Muhammad.  If this is truly of God… why are you ashamed of it?  As a Christian for me to go to either of my two grown sons and demand they give me their wife is unbelievable…. BUT!!!  If Muhammad was a prophet bringing the goodness of God forth to mankind… where is your public proclamation of his sexual example? These references come straight from your authoritative books…. They weren’t “made up” by people trying to smear him. Those of us today that have actually looked at Muhammad’s behavior generally consider him a sexual deviant.   Teach us otherwise.   Show us the goodness of “bedding down” 9 year old girls and taking wives from our adopted sons. Why did you not point out the special revelation from Allah that gave Muslim soldiers a “god given” right to rape the women captured on the battlefield?  It is not the absence of men, that explained the polygamy as your sugar coated article claims… it is the lust of men claiming to act for God with the power to do anything they wanted to people powerless to stop them! Here is that so called revelation from Allah, the one you should have presented to us… Book 29, Number 29.32.95: Yahya related to me from Malik from Rabia ibn Abi Abd ar-Rahman from Muhammad ibn Yahya ibn Habban that Ibn Muhayriz said, "I went into the mosque and saw Abu Said al-Khudri and so I sat by him and asked him about coitus interruptus. Abu Said al-Khudri said, 'We went out with the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, on the expedition to the Banu al-Mustaliq. We took some Arabs prisoner, and we desired the women as celibacy was hard for us. We wanted the ransom, so we wanted to practise coitus interruptus. We said, 'Shall we practise coitus interruptus while the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, is among us before we ask him?' We asked him about that and he said, 'You don't have to not do it. There is no self which is to come into existence up to the Day of Rising but that it will come into existence.' " Why did you not point out that Hadith that tells us it takes two women in Islam to testify in court against a man?  Because women aren’t as trustworthy and intelligent as men? Why did you not point out that the majority of hell’s inhabitants are women not thankful to their husbands? Why did you not go into the authoritative assessment that women were put here as sexual playthings? If Islam is really from God as you would have us to believe…. Why do you describe it deceitfully?  Give us the revelation! Why do you not just present the revelations that claim to come from God…. And allow people to judge for themselves. Be proud of your “god!” and your “god given” books! ! How can you call this “Heaven’s people of truth”  if the “truth” is hid from us? Did you notice I have not challenged the truthfulness of any of these “revelations” I only ask why you hide them? I am a Christian… I really believe Jesus came from God.  I want you to believe it to.  BUT!!! I am unwilling to describe a phony Jesus that does not exist to get you to buy into a Christianity that is not real.   Why do you present an Islam that is not real and is incomplete? Jerry Blount Pleasant Valley church of Christ 3317 Amidon rd. Wichita Kansas, 67204 3163204321 WWW.letJesusleadus.org Mavis B Jolly (England) I was born in a Christian environment, baptised in the Church of England, and attended a Church school where at a tender age I learned the story of Jesus as contained in the Gospels. It made a great emotional impression on me, as also did frequent visits to the church, the high altar with candles burning, the incense, the robed priests and the mysterious intoning of prayers... I suppose for those few years I was a fervent Christian. Then with the increase of schooling, and being in constant contact with the Bible and everything Christian I had the opportunity to think over what I had read and observed, practised and believed. Soon I began to be dissatisfied with many things. By the time I left school I was a complete atheist. Then I began to study the other main religions in the world. I began with Buddhism. I studied with interest the eightfold path, and felt that it contained good aims but was lacking in direction and details. In Hinduism I was faced not with three, but with hundreds of gods, the stories of which were too fantastic and revolting to me to be accepted. I read a little of Judaism, but I had already seen enough of the Old Testament to realize that it did not stand my tests of what a religion must be. A friend of mine persuaded me to study spiritualism and to sit for the purpose of being controlled by the discarnate spirits. I did not continue this practice very long as I was quite convinced that, in my case anyway, it was purely a matter of self-hypnosis, and would be dangerous to experiment further. The war ended. I took work in a London office, but my mind never strayed far from the religious quest. A letter appeared in the local paper to which I wrote a reply contradicting the divinity of Christ from the Biblical point of view. This brought me in contact with a number of people, one of whom was a Muslim. I started discussing Islam with this new acquaintance. On every point my desire to resist Islam fell down. Though I had thought it impossible, I had to acknowledge that perfect revelation had come through an ordinary human being, since the best of twentieth century governments could not improve upon that revelation, and were themselves continually borrowing from the Islamic system. At this time I met a number of other Muslims and some of the English girl converts endeavored to help me, with no little success, since, coming from the same background, they understood better some of my difficulties. I read a number of books, including The religion of Islam, Muhammad and Christ and The source of Christianity, the latter showing the amazing similarities between Christianity and the old pagan myths, impressed me greatly. Above all I read the Holy Qur'an. At first it seemed mainly repetition. I was never quite sure if I was taking it in or not, but the Qur'an, I found, works silently on the spirit. Night after night I could not put it down. Yet I often wondered how perfect guidance for man could come through imperfect human channels at all. Muslims made no claim for Muhammad that he was superhuman. I learned that in Islam prophets are men who have remained sinless, and that revelation was no new thing. The Jewish prophets of old received it. Jesus, too, was a prophet. Still it puzzled me why it did not happen any more in the twentieth century. I was asked to look at what the Qur'an said: "Muhammad is the Messenger of God and the last of the Prophets." And of course it was perfectly reasonable, too. How could there be other prophets to come if the Holy Qur'an was the book ... explaining all things and verifying that which is with you and if it was to remain uncorrupted in the world, as is guaranteed in the Qur'an, and perfectly kept so far? "Surely We have revealed the Reminder (i.e. the Qur'an) and surely We are its Guardian." In that case there could be no need of further prophets or books. Still I pondered. I read that the Qur'an is a guide to those who ponder (XVI: 65) and that doubters were asked to try and produce a chapter like it (II: 23). Surely, I thought, it must be possible to produce a better living plan in 1954, than this which dates back to a man born in the year 570 C.E.? I set to work, but everywhere I failed. No doubt, influenced by the usual condemnation of Islam from Christian pulpits on the subject, I picked on polygamy. At last I thought I had something; obviously Western monogamy was an improvement on this old system. I talked of it to my Muslim friend. He illustrated with the aid of newspaper articles how much true monogamy there was in England, and convinced me that a limited polygamy was the answer to the secret unions that are becoming so distressingly common in the West. My own common sense could see that, particularly after a war, when women of a certain age group far outnumber men, a percentage of them are destined to remain spinsters. Did God give them life for that? I recollect that on the radio programme known as `Dear Sir' an unmarried English girl had called for lawful polygamy, saying she would prefer a shared married life rather than the loneliness to which she seemed to be destined. In Islam no one is forced into a polygamous marriage, but in a perfect religion, the opportunity must be there to meet those cases where it is necessary. Then about ritual prayers I thought I had a point. Surely prayers repeated five times a day must become just a meaningless habit? My friend had a quick and illuminating answer. `What about your music practice, he asked, where you do scales for half an hour every day whether you feel like it or not? Of course, it is not good if it becomes a dead habit --- to be thinking of what is being done will give greater benefit --- but even scales done without thinking will be better than not doing them at all, and so it is with prayers.' Any music student will see the point of this, particularly if he bears in mind that in Islam prayers are not said for the benefit of God, Who is above needing them, but for our own benefit as a spiritual exercise, besides other uses. Thus gradually I became convinced of the truth in the teachings of Islam, and formally accepted the faith. I did this with great satisfaction, as I could fully realize that it was no emotional craze of the moment, but a long process of reasoning, lasting nearly two years, through which I went despite my emotions that pulled me so strongly the other way. From "Islam, Our Choice"